Make An Impact Podcast
Make An Impact Podcast
The Addiction You Can Hide In Plain Sight
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Gambling harm can look like nothing more than “a flutter” right up until it has swallowed someone’s work, relationships, confidence and mental health. I’m joined by Matt Smith, Director of External Affairs at Betknowmore UK, who speaks with rare honesty about his own recovery and why gambling addiction is so easy to hide even from yourself.
We get into what harm actually means in day-to-day life: the shame that drives isolation, the cognitive dissonance that makes everything feel manageable when it is not, and the gaps that can appear when professionals do not yet have the right awareness or pathways. Matt also explains why gambling harm affects people from every background, and why “affected others” such as parents, partners and friends often carry serious distress in silence too.
Matt breaks down how Betknowmore UK approaches gambling harms support as a public health issue, working with local authorities, NHS England and Public Health Scotland, and building community-based services that meet people where they already are. We talk prevention through accredited training, peer support through Peer Aid, women-only support via New Beginnings, and outreach like Goals that brings brief interventions into everyday community settings. We also explore the practical realities that sit underneath recovery, including debt, money taboo, and housing stability as a foundation for rebuilding life.
If you find this conversation useful, please subscribe, share the episode with someone who might need it, and leave a review so more people can find practical, stigma-free gambling harm support and recovery stories.
Contact Betknowmore UK: https://www.betknowmoreuk.org/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/betknowmore-uk/
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/betknowmoreuk/
Welcome to Make Impact Podcast, where we dive deep into the stories, strategies, and solutions that drive real change. I'm Heidi Fisher and I work with organisations on a mission to tackle poverty, reduce health inequalities, and create lasting social impact. In each episode, I bring you inspiring conversations with change makers, social entrepreneurs, and thought leaders who are making a difference.
Thank you for joining us on this episode of the Make an Impact podcast. I hope you found today's conversation as inspiring and thought provoking as I did. If you enjoyed the episode, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with others who want to create positive change. You can connect with me on LinkedIn and learn more about my work at Makeanimpactcic.co.uk.
Until next time, let's keep making an impact in the world.
Hi, I'm Heidi Fisher, the host of the Make an Impact Podcast. I'm an impact measurement expert, passionate about helping you make a bigger impact in the world by maximising the impact your services have.
I can help you to measure, manage and communicate the impact you have better to funders, investors, commissioners and other stakeholders, and to systemise your data collection and analysis so that it frees up time and doesn't become an additional burden.
I love helping you to measure social and economic impacts, including Social Return on Investment or value for money assessments, as part of understanding the change you make to peoples' lives.
You can get in touch via LinkedIn or the website makeanimpactcic.co.uk if you'd like to find out more about working with me.
When Gambling Takes Over
Speaker 1My experience of being around other people, my peers who are also in recovery today, is this takes no prisoners. People who are impacted by gambling harm are from absolutely all areas of life.
SpeakerWelcome to Make an Impact Podcast, where we dive deep into the stories, strategies, and solutions that drive real change. I'm Heidi Fisher and I work with organisations on a mission to tackle poverty, reduce health inequalities, and create lasting social impact. In each episode, I bring you inspiring conversations with change makers, social entrepreneurs and thought leaders who are making a difference. Whether you're looking to boost your impact measurement, learn from innovative projects, or find fresh ideas to transform your work and you're in the right
Matt’s Story And Defining Harm
Speakerplace. Welcome to today's episode of the Make an Impact podcast. Today I'm joined by Matt Smith. Matt, would you like to introduce yourself, please?
Speaker 1Yeah, thanks, Heidi. I'm Director of External Affairs at Betknowmore UK. So we're a gambling harms support charity. We're working across the UK. We started in London back in 2014 as a relatively small organisation, started up by our founder and CEO, Frankie Graham. And now, fast forward to 2026, we're an organisation with over 50 staff. And half of us have lived experience of gambling harm. I'm one of those. I've been with the charity now for five and a bit years. My background is actually in radio and television. So I worked in the media for 15 years, covering major sports events all around the world. But as part of my recovery journey from gambling harm, if you like, this sector was of real interest for me to get into and to try and support other people from the same things that happened to me. So yeah, really enjoying working with the organisation. As I say, we work across the UK, but now internationally as well. We started to work in the US and Canada. Gambling harms is a hot topic at the moment across the UK and with local authorities in particular. Something we're really passionate about and really interested in having this conversation with you about today.
SpeakerThank you, Matt. It's really good to have you here. And I'm fascinated to find out more about gambling harms and what that actually means when we're saying where people have got gambling issues, at what point does it become an issue and those kind
How Harm Shows Up Daily
Speakerof things? So I'd be really interested to find out a little bit more about how you know that gambling has become harmful.
Speaker 1It's really difficult hiding. Talking from my own experience, didn't realise that it was harming me at first. Of course, I understood from a point of view that my finances were not in good shape, but I didn't realise about the other things that were going on for me, the impact it was having on my working life, the impact it was having on my relationships with other people, my family, my friends, my work colleagues, the impact it was having on my wider mental health, my physical health, when I was in the midst of a gambling binge, let's say, I wouldn't have a shower for two or three days, for example. It gets into all areas of your life. And I think at first it's very difficult to identify am I actually experiencing harm here? Is this something that's really impacting my life? Because I think what gambling does, it creates a cognitive dissonance where you actually feel that you're okay when you're not okay. And because it's very hidden in terms of in comparison to other addictions, such as let's say alcohol and drugs, for example, it's quite challenging for others to spot that you have an issue as well and to perhaps raise that issue with you. So yeah, my own experience was for quite a long time I didn't realise it was an issue until eventually I ended up at my GP, or AGP, I should say, it wasn't my GP at the time, but a GP, who we talked very briefly about gambling, and I'm going back about 14-15 years now at Heidi, and I remember very clearly the GP saying to me, Do you want some medication? And I said, No, I just want to stop gambling, and that was it. That was the point for me I realised the harm that had been done. I realised at that point I just wanted to stop, and a lot of harm had taken place at that point.
Stigma, GPs And Early Recovery
SpeakerThat experience with the GP Matt, that must have been just bizarre for them to say, Do you want medication? Because that's not gonna prevent you from gambling again, is it? It's just kind of masking it, isn't it?
Speaker 1Yeah, yeah, completely. That was in 2012. I was staying with friends at the time. At that point, I was on the way out of my job. I'd been on an extended period of leave. So I worked at Talk Sport at the radio station for a long time. They tried to support me as best as they could, but they didn't really understand gambling harm either at that point. But they did try to support me for quite a long period and did want me to go back to work, but really they didn't understand the complexities of the issues I was facing because I didn't either. So I was going to counselling sessions and things like that. So I was staying with a friend, and that was when I'd had the appointment with the GP. And you're right, I wanted somebody to really understand what was going on for me, but there was completely no understanding. Now, on reflection, I don't have any ill feeling towards the GP at all on that because I don't think that the GPs understood themselves the impact on gambling. Look, fast forward to 2026, 14 years later, we're in a much better place now, and there is a lot more understanding around gambling harm at that level and at other levels. But yeah, back then that really did feed into the stigma and the shame around gambling harm because I just didn't feel that I'd been heard. I was going to gamblers anonymous meetings at that point, I'd started to go. But to be quite honest with you, I was gambling on the way to the meeting and I was drinking on the way home from the meeting. I wasn't not ready to engage at that point. It actually took me another two years until I actually settled into Gamblers Anonymous, and thankfully I've been there ever since. But it's a dreadful illness, Heidi, because it really does get into places that people just don't recognise in themselves.
SpeakerIt sounds like it, and to be honest, it's not something that I would have thought about in this way till we've started having this conversation. So you're educating me as you're talking about this, and I'm thinking actually, yeah, I can see that this could be a real issue and it could become really harmful to someone's life, whereas I just imagine it's just spending a bit of money.
Speaker 1Yeah, and you know what most people do, that's how they see it. And you know, let's be honest, people enjoy gambling, and some people enjoy having a bet or going to a race course or a casino or betting on a photo match, they may enjoy that, and that is fine, but there is a growing number of people who don't, who can't be like those people who are impacted by the harms of gambling. And my experience of being around other people, my peers who are also in recovery today, is this takes no prisoners.
Shame, Isolation And Family Fallout
Speaker 1People who are impacted by gambling harm are from absolutely all areas of life. You may not necessarily have come from a deprived area or a difficult upbringing. It doesn't matter what job you're in, it will take you. If you are vulnerable in some way, it will get into you. And that's exactly what I had to me. I had a very loving upbringing. My mum and I had a great relationship we still have today. I mean, we didn't for a period while I was gambling, let's be honest about that. I didn't speak to her for over a year and a half because I was so ashamed. She was worried out of her mind about me. She didn't know where I was, she didn't know what I was doing. She had to go for therapy herself around that. And it wasn't because I didn't want to speak to her. I loved my mum very much, but I I was so ashamed and embarrassed about how I'd behaved and what I'd done with gambling and where it had taken me. I'd gone from this fantastic job where I was travelling around the world watching sport for a living. My mum was really proud that I'd gone to university, had this great job. She brought me up by herself pretty much, and really was able to support my growth. And then for all this to happen and my world to fall apart was a big thing for her to shoulder as well. So she had to go to therapy, which I obviously didn't find out about until we started to talk again. Thankfully, we're in a much better place now. I'm 11 and a half years into my recovery now, and the last 10 years, I would say, we've had the best relationship we've ever had. She's 84 now, she lives pretty close to me down here on the south coast, and it's fantastic, but it wasn't for a long period, and there was other relationships that really fell by the wayside that gambling just destroyed Heidi. We tried to talk a lot about the isolation and the loneliness when you're in the middle of addiction, and that was me completely. Addiction got me into a place where I was in a corner, I couldn't get out of the corner, I didn't know where to turn, I didn't know who to speak to. I remember one of my friends, and at this point, when I was trying to get into recovery, I'd burned through all of my friends and contacts. I really didn't have anybody left other than what my one friend John. And I remember him saying to me when I finally got into recovery, why did you never talk to me about this? And that was because gambling and addiction as a whole, because I'm in sobriety as well at the same time. It took me into a corner and it isolated me and he didn't want me to talk about that. And I think that's why today we're trying to encourage more people to come forward, talk about Gambling Harm, talk about their experiences, because I do feel that is a way that we can empower ourselves and help others as well.
Turning Recovery Into Purpose
SpeakerYeah, it sounds like you've had a fascinating journey through your recovery process, and obviously, where does Betknowmore fit into that?
Speaker 1Amazing, really, because Frankie Graham, our founder and CEO, as I said at the beginning, is an individual with lived experience like me. And so, how this all came about for me, I as I say, I had a really successful career in the media. I came down to Bournemouth where I'm speaking to you today from. I'm still here today. This is home for me today. And I went to a treatment centre and I started going to gamblers anonymous meetings, started to build my recovery, started to do random jobs. I was working with my friend Jeff selling flowers on a market on a weekend. I was working in a furniture store for a while, anything to just get a roof over my head, start earning money again, start supporting myself, build up my self-esteem. And that went on for a number of years. And I did not know about Betknowmore. I did not know about this space even that I work in, this sector. I did not know about Gamcare and all the other organisations that work in our sector where people access help today. I didn't know they existed. All I knew was the treatment centre I went to and Gamblers Anonymous. So I came across the organisation and I managed to get a job working on one of our flagship services called Peer Aid, and I started working within Peer Aid as a coordinator on the team. And I started to get to know Frankie quite well, and Frankie said to me, Look, stick with us. We're in a period of growth. We want to support your development and stick with this for a couple of years, and we'll move you up the ladder pretty quickly. Which Frankie stuck to his word, and it took me probably three and a half years, and I moved right up to director level, sitting on the senior management team. That was fantastic. And Frankie, I think, has a real understanding about people with lived experience, giving them something to do where they feel that they're empowered now, and also using lived experience not just as a token gesture, but actually as a really fundamental part of the organisation. So you've got the CEO with lived experience, you have two of our directors, me and my colleague Leanne, both have lived experience, our trustees have lived experience, we have a lived experience advisory board alongside that, and then we have it right through the organisation. So this isn't just a token gesture to yeah, we'll put lived experience in the organisation. This is actually about saying people with lived experience, they're not just about their lived experience, they're professionals as well. We have skills that we've had for years and years that we can give to people, and I think Frankie really recognised that, and I actually think that is now a growing trend across our sector, just in gambling, but in others as well, to say we don't need to just give that person a job because they're lived experience. Let's have a look at their professional life as well and how we can marry the two together. So this is perfect for me now, this role going out and speaking to people about my lived experience and putting all of my professional skills to use.
SpeakerI was gonna say you should be running my podcast. You can. Another job to add to the Yeah, definitely.
What BetNomore UK Actually Does
SpeakerBut in terms of Betknowmore, what is it about campaigning, awareness raising, support, or is it all of those preventing it?
Speaker 1All of those. We're busy these days. We're really busy. So we're delighted that recently, for the first time, our sector's changed in terms of the funding, and we're delighted to have been funded by three commissioners in the recent commissioning rounds. So by OHED, by NHS England, and also Public Health Scotland. So absolutely delighted that we've managed to win three government contracts to continue to support people from gambling harm and also prevent gambling harms. So we have prevention programmes, which are typically built around gambling harms awareness training. We have a training programme called Don't Bet on Your Health, which is accredited by CPD and also by the Royal Society of Public Health, which is very good training for local authorities and statutory bodies to understand what gambling harms looks like. Very important when they talk about local authorities because for a number of years all of this work has been left to the voluntary sector. It's only in the recent one or two years that public health teams up and down the country have now picked up on gambling harms. Some public health directors have even expressed to me that they have been asleep at the wheel during this happening. They have had other priorities to be fair, but it's now time for them to really get on board about gambling and start to support their residents as well as best they can. So we have the training, which is typically for frontline people, customer contact people who are working in local authorities or statutory bodies or even voluntary sector. So, for example, we work with organisations like mine, in London, to train their staff on gambling harm. We then go into local authorities and do wider pieces of strategic work, system change work, really starting to look like what work is being done within a local authority around gambling harm and support them to grow that work. We have a community outreach program called Goals, which stands for gambling outreach and living support. That has been a fantastic successful program which we've been running in Islington for a couple of years now, Heidi. And that was born out of a conversation with at the time Councillor Dr. John Wolfe, who was the cabinet lead for community safety in Islington. And John really understood the impact of addiction on people's lives, but said we're not doing enough about gambling, we should be doing more. And what John really supported us with was getting a position at 222 Upper Street in Islington, which is the council hub where residents go for all sorts of issues: housing, council tax, pay a parking fine, whatever it might be. And we're there once a week with our team who have both have lived experience of gambling, and residents can come in and talk about gambling and start to learn a little bit about what it looks like. We've been there now for just short of two years once a week, and I think we've done something like nearly two and a half thousand brief interventions, which is an incredible number in such a small borough in London, considering we're there once a week. And we're now looking to that service into other areas of London as well. So I know, for example, Brent are very interested in the work we're doing, Westminster are very interested. So getting that across into other councils in London and hopefully across the UK in time as well. And then we have a couple of support services alongside that. So we have Peer Aid, which I touched upon earlier, which was the start of my journey at Betknowmore. Peer Aid is a peer support service. Our volunteers go through a rigorous 30-hour City and Guild accredited training program to become a gambling lived experienced peer supporter. They have to demonstrate that they have a certain amount of recovery behind them and they're doing certain things in their own recovery. And we, the very important thing with all that, Heidi, is we safeguard those individuals as well. And we have Jill, who is our in-house clinician who looks after them, which I think is a really important part of what we do because when you're using your lift experience, it's actually really important that you're looked after as well. So that program's been fantastic and supported so many people. And what it's also done, Heidi, is it's created an ecosystem within our sector. So people have typically come in for support, they've then become a volunteer and supported others, and then they've gone on to work in the sector, or at bet no more. So not only have people have come in to us for help, they've then gone on to work in the sector, which is a real testament to how far the organisations come. And then lastly, we have New Beginnings, which is our women's only programme, which is a structured support service for women ran by women. And in all of this, it's really important to say it's not just about the gamblers themselves, it's about the affected other. I touched on my mum earlier and how she was impacted by gambling harm. It's not just about mums and dads or brothers or sisters, it's about work holidays, it's about friends, it's about the local community. How are people affected by gambling harm? So one of our strategic priorities over the next three years is really to enhance the work we're doing around affected others and make sure that they're getting the help that they need as well.
SpeakerWow. That's a lot of work. You're busy doing there. Um no wonder you've grown and you've got so many staff now.
Debt, Housing And Real-World Pressures
SpeakerThere, you talked about gambling harm being a public health issue and a health issue. I've always thought of it as it's a financial one. So, what in terms of the financial side, is there anyone giving you money to work on that side of it?
Speaker 1We are going to start doing some more of this kind of partnership work. So we have a good relationship already with Citizens Advice Bureau, for example, and we're going to be talking to them more in London and of course in in Scotland as well, where Citizens Adv ice Scotland have been commissioned to do some of this work. Because you're absolutely right, the two go hand in hand. Again, I'm a very good example of this. I have never owned a property in my life, and up until four months ago, at the age of 47, I bought my first home. And that was because during my recovery, I understood more about finances. I managed to clean up all of my debts, make sure that I got into a good position. I had some really good people around me. My friend Dean, who runs a mortgage advisory company, understood my challenges that I'd faced in the past, so was really able to support me on that journey. So I think to answer the question, yes, there is a real importance here now to engage with other voluntary sector organisations like Step Change as well, for example. Anybody who's working in that kind of financial space really should be working more with gambling Harms organisations because the two are absolutely interlinked.
SpeakerYeah, I think it it's always that case of where you look at the kind of the outward manifestation of an issue and you see somebody's mental health is deteriorating or they're isolating themselves. So you think all there's a well-being or health issue, but actually there's a whole host of other stuff under the surface that you've also got to look at and resolve. And um, if you don't, then you're still gonna have that outward external manifestation continue forever.
Speaker 1Oh, totally. One of the biggest challenges for me, Heidi, was housing. When I first got into recovery, I was in a treatment centre for six months, so basically I was in supported accommodation, but then when I came out of there, I had nothing to support myself, so I had no money to get a deposit to get a rent a flat. But I really couldn't see a way out. Thankfully, I had a friend who I'd made in the treatment centre who offered me the deposit to get a flat, and that was so kind of him, and he really supported me with that. And so that was almost a stepping stone because I'm a firm believer that you need a roof over your head, basically, to be able to start a journey of recovery. So something that I'm really passionate about, I've been talking to other organisations about how we can support people who've been affected by gambling harm to find that support so that they can get housing again. But we also have to recognise that there's a lot of housing pressures across the whole country, lots of different ways. So if you want to help somebody to get back into long term recovery, having that roof over their head and that structure in their life is a real stepping stone into rebuilding and reclaiming their life again.
Early Signs And Starting Conversations
SpeakerOne of the things that I'm always keen to think about from a health perspective is how do we stop these things? Never happening in the first place. So, what are some of the things that you would say are the early signs where perhaps we we could stop somebody ending up in a position where they've got gambling harm in their life?
Speaker 1Yeah, it's a really good question because quite often I'm asked, what is the silver bullet? What is the number one thing we can do? And it's so difficult because gambling is so hidden. But what I would always say is start to look for you can see subtle changes in behaviour. If you can see that there is more, let's say somebody's been a bit more defensive around finances and around money, and maybe bills aren't getting paid, or there's a lot more stress and anxiety, particularly in a relationship. There's early warning signs there, but typically as partners or family, we tend to ignore the warning signs a little bit because we think we we trust them, we love them, they're our do you know what I mean? They're our families, they're our partners, they're our friends. So it's very difficult to then say to somebody, you know, do you do you want to talk to me about what's been right now? And there I'd had opportunities in the past to talk, but I didn't. But the one thing I always say to people is if you can have some form of a conversation when you do start to see things developing, it might not come out there and then, but what it might do, Hyde, is it might plant a seed for the future. And I think that's what the really important thing is because I remember very clearly one of my old colleagues, Mark Sagers, who was one of the presenters I worked with at Talk Sport, who is an ambassador at Betknowmore as well. Now, he's also in recovery for gambling. You won't mind me saying that because he talks about it regularly as well. And we were in New Zealand together in 2011, and he we were sat in a restaurant, and he said to me, Now I'd like to have a conversation with you about gambling. Now, I wasn't ready at that point to have that conversation, so it got shut down pretty quickly, probably 2022, something like that, 2023. We met again for the first time, we'd not seen each other for all of that time. And one of the first things he said to me was, Do you remember that conversation we had in New Zealand? And I said, Absolutely, of course I remember it. So I always say to people, please don't be disheartened if you start having that conversation. Look out for those little subtle changes in behaviour, look out for subtle changes in finances, what's happening with finances, everything was going okay and now it's not going okay. Things don't just happen like that today in life. Finances suddenly don't just start to disappear into different areas. So it's always worthwhile just looking out for those things.
SpeakerDo you think it's because as a society we don't like talking about money that gambling can be so well hidden?
Speaker 1You have hit the nail on the head. I've been banging on about this for years, yeah. Of course. It's taboo, isn't it, to talk about money. Even if my own mum asks me about money today, I still start to clam my pillar. She does, by the way, she still does us today in a very good way. She always asks me, Are you okay? Are you okay with money today? I've become comfortable with that conversation today, but a lot of people haven't, have they? It's still very difficult, don't want to talk about all of those types of things. So I do think that the two are linked. I do think that can feed into shame and stigma. So I think we do have to be open more about talking about money. But I would go back to not just the financial side of gambling, but the emotional, the physical, the mental side, all of those things, because I was quite a good earner. I've got other friends who are in recovery today, who earned good salaries, who had good jobs. The amounts of money that we gambled didn't matter. And I can tell you now, if I gambled a four-figure son, or if I gambled a one-figure son, it made no difference. It made no difference whatsoever to how the outcome or how I felt about it. And I think that's what I've been talking a lot about is let's look out for emotional vulnerability, not just financial vulnerability. Yes, financial vulnerability can point us to emotional vulnerability, and we can look at somebody's finances of thinking, hang on, something's going a little bit off there. It wasn't like that previously. And then we can have the conversation about that kind of emotional and mental health as well.
Neighbourhood Health And Who Funds Support
SpeakerOne question I wanted to ask you about was around the neighbourhood health agenda. And do you think that creates more opportunities to get this support into communities? Or do you think that actually it's still going to be quite top-down in terms of how health services are delivered?
Speaker 1No, I think there is an opportunity there with the neighbourhood health centres and feeds into the government's 10-year plan as well. I think for us, we've already been identifying those neighbourhood health centres where they're going to be, particularly in London, so that we can start to look at trying to get into them because we do believe in that holistic approach to gambling. The work we've done in Islington at the council premises has been a real eye-opener. So you can imagine that is one place where residents are accessing for a range of different issues. If we can then start to be in a neighbourhood health centre which is dealing with a range of health issues, then we're going to see a completely different cohort of individuals who are coming in there for other health, other addictions, perhaps. We've got gambling going on at the same time as I expressed to you earlier. It's not just about gambling for me, but I'm also in sobriety. So the two are hand in hand. So I do think that is going to be a really important model moving forwards. We're a bit unsure at the moment how exactly our space is going to be commissioned. There is the thought that it will be commissioned by ICBs in the future, but of course there is question marks over what that looks like as well. What we're really keen on saying is: look, the NHS only in recent years have opened the NHS gambling clinics and other services, the NHS primary care gambling service. But the voluntary sector's been working in this space for 15-20 years. You have to understand and utilise that experience. What we don't want to do is get all of the experience that we've got around gambling harm to get lost in a system. We need to make sure that really the voluntary sector continues to be front and centre, particularly with this type of work. It is very much community-based. You have to go out and find people who are experiencing gambling harm because of the stigma. They're not going to come to us. We have to go out and find them. And when we do that, we see results. As I mentioned earlier, two and a half thousand people we've seen over the past couple of years who wanted to have a conversation with us about their gambling or somebody else's gambling.
SpeakerYeah, I agree. The voluntary community organisations, social enterprises, they're usually closest to the communities and they know what's happening, they can spot things that are coming on the horizon. They're best placed to be delivering these services and communities. And I'm not going to shut up to saying that over and over. If you're an ICB or a health and well-being partnership board, your money should be predominantly going to the VCSE sector because they're the ones that can actually deliver your ambitions. Yeah.
Speaker 1And that's what I'm really keen on with our sector, because we have seen mental health services in the past get folded back into the NHS, and then the voluntary sector then starts to fall away, and you then lose all of that experience. And even in the gambling harm sector, we transition now into this new world we're calling it under the Department of Social Care and the NHS funding. We have lost people from our space, we have lost organisations from our space because we've been through a competitive bidding process for contracts. We never wanted that to happen that way. So I think it's really important that moving forwards that, like you said, the voluntary sector is not forgotten. There's a lot of experience there. They're working in the communities on the ground. They can get into places that the NHS simply cannot get into.
Where To Find Help
SpeakerMatt, it has been fantastic talking to you today. Where can people find out more about Betknowmore?
Speaker 1Yeah, please visit our website. So betknowmoreuk.org. The know in Betknowmore is with a K. So K N O W. Know for knowledge. So Betknowmoreuk.org is our website. You can find us on LinkedIn as well, Betknowmore UK. You can find me on LinkedIn as well, Matt Smith, Betknowmore UK. We're on Instagram as well, so you can find us there. We talk a lot about our community work. Again, Betknowmore UK. And yeah, really delighted to speak to you today, Heidi, and thanks for your time.
SpeakerThank you so much. Thank you, Matt. It's been fantastic. Thank you for joining us on this episode of the Make an Impact Podcast. I hope you found today's conversation as inspiring and thought provoking as I did. If you enjoyed the episode, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with others who want to create positive change. You can connect with me on LinkedIn and learn more about my work at makeanimpact cic.co.uk. Until next time, let's keep making an impact in the world.